Mortgage Servicing Fraud
occurs post loan origination when mortgage servicers use false statements and book-keeping entries, fabricated assignments, forged signatures and utter counterfeit intangible Notes to take a homeowner's property and equity.
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Skippy10

 Hello everyone. I hope I'm not beating a dead horse, but I have a problem, and don't know where to turn. I have a mortgage, and it's serviced through Ocwen. Until 2 weeks ago, I thought we were paying on a 30 year mortgage, but after looking on their website, it says it's a 40 year mortgage. I have the documentation that says 30 years. I have been paying on it for 6 years, and the principle ( I hope I spelled that right) doesn't seem to be coming down much. My payment is $1100/month, so I would hate to think it didn't go down but just under $3000 in 6 years. Also, the folks that originated our loan had me forge documents to even get the loan. I think our property value was over inflated too. Where I live, nobody sells their houses, and haven't in 40 years or more, so a good appraisal can't be gotten. There is other problems we have had with Ocwen too. I am completely ignorant to stuff like this, so I kind of feel dumb and embarrassed about this whole deal. I need to know what I can do about this. I can afford my payments, but it's tough at times. In fact, right when I first got the mortgage, I was out of work for a few months, due to an injury, and I got behind. They put me on a forbearance plan, to catch up the 2 payments I was behind, over the course of 2 years. They reported me late on my credit bureau for the 2 years I was paying it. Ocwen is horrible to deal with. I am trying to get refinanced to a lower interest rate of 3 5/8% for 15 years (I'm paying 9.25% now), but I'm afraid I can't get a good appraisal, due to location, and lack of market history.I would appreciate any help/advice anyone could give me.

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George Burns
If you find it tough at times to pay on a 30 or 40 year mortgage, Why is it going to be easier to pay a 15 year mortgage? The shorter the term, the higher the payment.

If your property value was "over inflated" when you got the loan, How will you handle the deficiency if the new "good appraisal" is less, as you seem to want? For example, if the current mortgage was "over inflated" at say $120,000 and you get a new "good appraisal" of $100,000, How will you pay off the old with less money?

Each month you get a statement from Ocwen which clearly shows the distribution of each monthly payment including how much goes towards principal. At the end of each year you get a statement and a !098 showing the breakdown for the year. You have been getting these for 6 years. How can you just be seeing that the reduction in Principal was not what you expected?
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Bill
Skippy10 wrote:

 Hello everyone. I hope I'm not beating a dead horse, but I have a problem, and don't know where to turn. I have a mortgage, and it's serviced through Ocwen. Until 2 weeks ago, I thought we were paying on a 30 year mortgage, but after looking on their website, it says it's a 40 year mortgage. I have the documentation that says 30 years. I have been paying on it for 6 years, and the principle ( I hope I spelled that right) doesn't seem to be coming down much. My payment is $1100/month, so I would hate to think it didn't go down but just under $3000 in 6 years. Also, the folks that originated our loan had me forge documents to even get the loan. I think our property value was over inflated too. Where I live, nobody sells their houses, and haven't in 40 years or more, so a good appraisal can't be gotten. There is other problems we have had with Ocwen too. I am completely ignorant to stuff like this, so I kind of feel dumb and embarrassed about this whole deal. I need to know what I can do about this. I can afford my payments, but it's tough at times. In fact, right when I first got the mortgage, I was out of work for a few months, due to an injury, and I got behind. They put me on a forbearance plan, to catch up the 2 payments I was behind, over the course of 2 years. They reported me late on my credit bureau for the 2 years I was paying it. Ocwen is horrible to deal with. I am trying to get refinanced to a lower interest rate of 3 5/8% for 15 years (I'm paying 9.25% now), but I'm afraid I can't get a good appraisal, due to location, and lack of market history.I would appreciate any help/advice anyone could give me.


You really need to gather all the paperwork and slowly carefully read it.  While you may have signed a 30 year note, your "forbearance plan" may not have been exactly what you thought it was.  You could have signed an agreement that extended the loan as part of this "forbearance".  I am just speculating, the only way to truly find out is to read all of the paperwork (or maybe call Ocwen).  

I agree with George that you have gotten statements that show how the payments have been applied.  I do think that there is also a chance that your "forbearance" could have added fees and charges also.  I would suggest again that you carefully read what you signed.  

While your situation will dictate if a refinance will improve your position, unfortunately refinancing may not separate you from Ocwen.  The lender decides who they use as a servicer.  You could refinance and still have to deal with Ocwen.  
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OWH
Skippy

9.25% interest... WOW 

You need a loan modification.
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Skippy10

 The mortgage company I am working with now assured me it wouldn't be with Ocwen. With my new interest rate, my payment is the same for 15 years as it is on my 30 or 40 year note. My forbearance plan is paid out. Unfortunately, I probably wouldn't understand what I was reading. My financial planning ability is worse than my spelling and grammar. I know I get statements every month, but at the time, I didn't have much choice. I have ask Ocwen about the 40 year instead of 30 years, and they told me not to worry about it. There is no mention of forbearance in my loan documents. I have read over them, but Ocwen isn't even mentioned in them. I had no idea my loan would be sold. 

 Now, Mr George Burns, I appreciate the help, but I don't appreciate the condescending attitude. You don't know me, or know my situation. I know my mistakes, I don't need you or anyone else to point them out to me. I'm asking how to correct my mistake, not to be talked down to. For the rest that talked to me like an adult, thanks.

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Bill
I really think that your problems are stemming from the "forbearance" agreement. This would be an agreement that came from you missing 2 payments and would NOT be part of your original loan documents.  I think this is also evident in Ocwen's response "don't worry about it".  They could have added fees and charges then extended the loan to keep the payment the same.  Just another crooked thing some servicers do.  As I said before, I'm just speculating, no one can be for sure without reading the documents, but it WON'T be in the original loan documents if you signed a 30 year mortgage.  

If you are having trouble understanding this you are not alone.  Don't feel bad.  Before you sign a new loan:

1.  Ask a friend to read and help you understand the documents.

2.  Ask a lawyer to read the documents.  Usually it is not terribly expensive to have an attorney just read and explain these documents.

3.  Find a consumer advocacy group that will read and explain these documents for you.

Bottom line, the purchase of a home/refinance is the biggest purchase most homeowners will ever make.  Get some help.


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Skippy10

I have never seen any paperwork/documents from Ocwen other than statements. I have never signed anything for them. The forbearance plan is something they told me about over the phone. Kind of like " we can help you catch up these payments, by paying a little bit more each month. It's called our forbearance plan. You pay on it for 2 years." That was the extent of it. I am used to working with a hometown bank, where someone isn't trying to break one off in you, every time you turn around. Unfortunately, they sold out to a big bank while I was going through this.

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Chuck

Quote:
I have never seen any paperwork/documents from Ocwen other than statements. I have never signed anything for them. The forbearance plan is something they told me about over the phone. Kind of like " we can help you catch up these payments, by paying a little bit more each month. It's called our forbearance plan. You pay on it for 2 years." That was the extent of it. I am used to working with a hometown bank, where someone isn't trying to break one off in you, every time you turn around. Unfortunately, they sold out to a big bank while I was going through this. 

 

You need to understand and appreciate that Ocwen IS one of the subprime servicers.

 

They have servicing fraud down to a science.  As Bill points out, they will purposefully misapply payments, pad your mortgage and escrows with unexplained, unwarranted and unsupportable fees and then avoid telling you about it.

 

What you describe as to the amortization of your loan does NOT sound unusual though.  VERY LITTLE principal is paid down in the early years of most loans.

 

In seeking to refinance, you are a bit "over a barrel".  Ocwen KNOWS THIS.  This is a fundamental principle of predatory fraudulent servicing.  In order to refinance, your new lender has to PAY OFF THE OLD LOAN.  The outstanding balance turns out to be WHAT OCWEN SAYS IT IS.

 

That is, if Ocwen presents a loan payoff amount, THAT AMOUNT and no other is what is required for them to RELEASE THE OLD LIEN.

 

Now if Ocwen has been hosing you and padding your monthly payment and balance in a variety of their creative ways, such as adding a generous (to them) LATE FEE every month, adding Broker Price Opinions, a "modification fee", "attorney's fees" or the like, the trouble is that while you MIGHT have a valid cause of action to get these trash fees REMOVED, it will usually COST YOU MORE IN LEGAL FEES TO DO THIS THAN THE AMOUNTS IN DISPUTE.

 

You will NOT get the new loan without paying off whichever figure they identify.  The refinance looks sufficiently attractive that you probably ought to do this as quickly as possible EVEN IF YOU ARE BEING HOSED.

 

This is NOT to say that you should turn a blind eye.  CHECK THE NUMBERS.  EXPECT TO FIND SOME MISCHIEF.  Then be prepared to make a business decision that it is better to pay what they ask and GET RIPPED OFF, since the alternative is to continue getting ripped off at the predatory interest rate every month.

 

Also, bear in mind that Ocwen has probably been reporting you are DELINQUENT to the credit bureau every month, even in respect of the "modification".  This is also part of the servicing fraud scam.

 

The idea is to TRAP YOU in an uneconomic mortgage.  First, they will usually post a payment late and charge you a late fee, even if you pay ON TIME.  You neglect or refuse to pay the late fee and the next month, you are charged another LATE FEE for not having paid the first late fee.  This cascades.

 

Eventually, they fold in other strategies.  These include pretending that you let your insurance expire and then putting an expensive forced placed insurance policy on your house and then charging you the inflated premium.

 

Everything they do is designed to rip you off.  When you cannot make a payment, they offer you a modification.  They use this as a pretext to tack on additional fees and charges.

 

They will report you as being delinquent from the very first payment that they misapply.  The ALWAYS over-report delinquencies, because this will KEEP YOU FROM GETTING A REFINANCE WITH ANOTHER LENDER.

 

You really need to carefully check ALL of the loan paperwork.  It is very likely that your loan also includes a PREPAYMENT PENALTY.  They will charge you an ENORMOUS FEE to pay off the loan.  This is also put in place to discourage you from refinancing.

 

IF YOU HAVE SUBSTANTIAL EQUITY IN THE PROPERTY, REFINANCING IS PROBABLY A VERY GOOD IDEA.  IF YOU HAVE THIN OR NEGATIVE EQUITY AND FACE A STIFF PREPAYMENT PENALTY, YOU ALSO NEED TO ASSESS WHETHER A STRATEGIC DEFAULT MAKES SENSE.

 

On the other hand, if you have net negative equity, you are very UNLIKELY to get a refinance loan from another lender.

 

Finally, realize that you are entitled to send your lender a RESPA Qualified Written Request (QWR).  There are some older threads where this is discussed.  You might consider putting together some good questions for a QWR and sending these to Ocwen.

 

I do not mean to come across as overly negative, but unless you are already well acquainted with what your credit report shows, you may be in for a rude awakening.  IF Ocwen has been reporting you late every month, this has been for the express purpose of PREVENTING YOU FROM REFINANCING and it is VERY LIKELY TO HAVE THIS EFFECT!  A combination of thin equity and poor credit would make you a bad candidate for refinancing.

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Unregistered
Skippy, if you haven't done this already within the past year, you can get a free credit report here:


This the only authorized free credit report site, and it is really free. NO credit card required. A report from three major credit reporting agencies is available once a year. 
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